tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1631912103702174313.post9825798152228577..comments2023-06-12T01:24:45.924-07:00Comments on Venezuela-Europa: Venezuelan colours IIKeplerhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/11125538872924743270noreply@blogger.comBlogger9125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1631912103702174313.post-44206824324717881372012-05-20T03:36:47.408-07:002012-05-20T03:36:47.408-07:00Wao! Y haplogroup B* in Venezuela? That's very...Wao! Y haplogroup B* in Venezuela? That's very unique. There are like 6% of Venezuelans with Y chromosome haplogroups from sub-Saharan Africa, but they are mostly from other types. Whereabouts in Venezuela are you from? I am from Valencia. When did they do the test? It can take time. The initial tests took for me about one month. I have found out much more about my paternal haplogroup and heritage now, I still lack more information from my mother's side, unfortunately. On a recent account I managed to get more information on what part of Spain my paternal ancestor very probably came from and I combined that information with census and voting registries and got some interesting stuff I will be writing about later on. Keep us posted about your results! on Venezuelan colours IIKeplerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11125538872924743270noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1631912103702174313.post-13817130906039070202012-05-17T08:46:17.033-07:002012-05-17T08:46:17.033-07:00Hi Kepler,
I'm Venezuelan too, followed the Ge...Hi Kepler,<br />I'm Venezuelan too, followed the Genographic Project route, and later uploaded my results to Family Tree DNA, where I manage a Y dna project for my surname. I became so into it, that even became a member of the International Society for Genetic Genealogy.<br />I was absolutely shocked to find out that I'm haplogroup B*. <br />Furthermore, B is rare even in Africa, not to mention Venezuela.<br />Currently, my DNA is being analyzed by the lab at FTDNA (the company that tests for the Genographic Project) because there are so few of us. They have very few templates for my haplogroup, and as the labs director told me, what they lear about my DNA will benefit future members of HG B--which is no consolation for me anyway.<br />I will follow with a mtDNA test--if I ever receive my YDNA refine tests from FTDNA back. They are taking their time.<br />I'm glad to discover that I'm not the only Venezuelan interested in genetic genealogy.Politikushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04301456340797650207noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1631912103702174313.post-47284518091156347332009-10-01T23:21:00.477-07:002009-10-01T23:21:00.477-07:00I have a complex ancestry: only like 60% is genuin...I have a complex ancestry: only like 60% is genuinely Basque. My ancestry also includes an aristocratic Italian line, vassals of the Este family. <br /><br /><a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ponziani" rel="nofollow">This guy</a> seems to be in my line of ancestry somewhere and <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frances_of_Rome" rel="nofollow">this woman too</a>. Though Ponziani was my (maternal) Grandfather's third or fourth surname, these people are anyhow claimed as direct ancestors in my family. A more direct ancestor created the public bank of Modena some 150 or 200 years ago. <br /><br />But these are all by my mother's side (her paternal side). But my mtDNA and Y-DNA should both be local, at least as far as I can tell. <br /><br />By my Basque strictly paternal side there's a legend of some guy being a privateer, maybe in the Jenkin's Ear War. A safer more recent reference mentions that my grandfather's granfather (or something like that) owned a forge and was owed payement for some horses in the First Carlist War. Whatever the case, my great-grandfather migrated to the city and eventually sold off the family farmhouse to provide for his unmarried sister, both of whom I knew in person when I was very very young.Majuhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12369840391933337204noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1631912103702174313.post-71371297433525287442009-10-01T13:30:54.259-07:002009-10-01T13:30:54.259-07:00Yeah, I know, but to some extend in the case of V...Yeah, I know, but to some extend in the case of Venezuela the haplogroups tell us a lot of the hardly recorded history we had.<br /><br />What? Your ancestors were in Italy in the Renaissance? I thought they had been in Euskal Herria since Magdalenian times <b>behintzat</b>! :-)Keplerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11125538872924743270noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1631912103702174313.post-83857017630466327702009-10-01T12:00:58.739-07:002009-10-01T12:00:58.739-07:00Do you have access to the whole article? My matern...<i>Do you have access to the whole article? My maternal haplotype is not so common</i>. <br /><br />No, sorry. :(<br /><br /><i>...but I think most people with sub-Saharan haplogroups in Venezuela have ancestors from a more direct slave trade, the sub-Saharan mtDNA is definitely higher in Venezuela</i>.<br /><br />Sure. I was just mentioning the possibility. L(xM,N) in Spain similarly could be from Canarian native, North African or truly Trans-Saharan origin (there was also many slaves for a time in Andalusia, though most of them were sent to Cuba upon metropolitan abolition).<br /><br /><i>I have thought about this event, where a British pirate, Hawkins brought two ships full of slaves from Guinea to a port not so far from the city where my grandmother and I were born. That was in the XVI century already. There were probably other ships arriving there with more slaves</i>.<br /><br />It's a logical possibility but you never know. One thing is for sure: our ancestry is always lost at some point in the dark depths of time. Even the most accurate genealogy can only reach that far. I can trace some of my ancestors to Renaissance Italy (more or less arguably) but for the most part only vague references, if any at all, exist for beyond the third or fourth generation back. Maybe it's better that way.Majuhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12369840391933337204noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1631912103702174313.post-67220149394017833072009-10-01T11:36:47.953-07:002009-10-01T11:36:47.953-07:00Yeah, I have seen this, there ar also sub-Saharan ...Yeah, I have seen this, there ar also sub-Saharan mtDNA samples in the Iberian peninsula proper, but I think most people with sub-Saharan haplogroups in Venezuela have ancestors from a more direct slave trade, the sub-Saharan mtDNA is definitely higher in Venezuela.<br /><br />I have thought about<br /><a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carabobo#15th_and_16th_centuries" rel="nofollow">this event</a>, where a British pirate, Hawkins brought two ships full of slaves from Guinea to a port not so far from the city where my grandmother and I were born. That was in the XVI century already. There were probably other ships arriving there with more slaves.<br /><br />Do you have access to the whole article? My maternal haplotype is not so common.Keplerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11125538872924743270noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1631912103702174313.post-60522123195002449172009-10-01T10:50:11.746-07:002009-10-01T10:50:11.746-07:00I think we have already discussed this but just in...I think we have already discussed this but just in case: "Sub-Saharan" mtDNA could well be from the Canary islands, and, if so it could be original from the slave trade or genuinely native from the archipelago, as it is precisely the Guanche aDNA which has somehow proven that some L(xM,N) existed in North Africa prior to the slave trade - something I already suspected but <a href="http://mathildasanthropologyblog.wordpress.com/2009/05/16/mt-dna-from-la-palma-guanche-remains/" rel="nofollow">was confirmed recently</a>.Majuhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12369840391933337204noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1631912103702174313.post-21996436538415510892009-10-01T10:03:02.735-07:002009-10-01T10:03:02.735-07:00Hi, Maju.
Thanks for the references. I will proba...Hi, Maju.<br />Thanks for the references. I will probably find it with the right key words.<br /><br />That phenomenon is probably widespread where European males kept arriving in meaningful numbers, as Colombia, Venezuela and probably Argentina and Uruguay, as opposed to Bolivia or Peru.<br /><br />As I mentioned earlier, my maternal line is rather European or native-American-European and yet the mtDNA is sub-Saharan. My maternal grandfather looked very Germanic and a great-great-grandfather was from the canary Islands. Probably it happened over and over.<br /><br />Still, even in the public hospital there is a small group of European mtDNA in Venezuela.<br /><br />That is more so in the cities than in the villages, as you will see from the article I mentioned in your blog.<br /><br />You can see my previous post on this <br /><a href="http://venezuela-europa.blogspot.com/2009/09/venezuelan-colours.html" rel="nofollow">here</a>, where they talked about autosomal material.<br /><br />I forgot to add the percentages in this post, I will update that later some time in the week.Keplerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11125538872924743270noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1631912103702174313.post-27128642868918218522009-10-01T09:20:53.832-07:002009-10-01T09:20:53.832-07:00Hi there, Kepler.
I'd like to add that, from...Hi there, Kepler. <br /><br />I'd like to add that, from memory, there was a study on Colombians (could be Venezuelans but rings more like Colombians from the Santa Marta or maybe Cartagena area - it's just a memory) that showed that, while mtDNA was almost universally native, the X-DNA was largely European. This implied that a lot of successive generations of immigrant men had been mating with local women, who preserved the native mtDNA but were each generation more European overall. <br /><br />Of course this may not be the case in other regions (and I'd add that in most cases in the Old World the mtDNA rather seems to represent best the overall genetic heritage, rather than the more elusive Y-DNA) but it's a curious phenomenon in an area that was surely the welcome port of many generations of male immigrants but that seldom saw an immigrant woman. <br /><br />In other Latin American cases, again from memory (a more recent paper anyhow), the X-DNA was more in agreement with the overall autosomal inheritance. But there were curious variations depending on the population. <br /><br />Sorry I can't provide the links but I've lost a lot of bookmarks in computer crashes. I think the latter was a PLoS paper anyhow.Majuhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12369840391933337204noreply@blogger.com